Ok so after a season of giving up on my sourdough, it’s now baking season jn the northeast and I’m brining it back. I always get tasty bakes, which I think have good structure inside (they aren’t dense) but they are always flat. I wasn’t sure if I was under or over proofing, or not shaping right… I tried a few tried and true techniques and every time had the same problem. The second I took it out of the proofing basket poof- shape lost. I have some sourdough proofing right now, it’s been just under 4 hours since shaping. What do we think?
by Primary_Dream9341
19 Comments
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I know it all depends but on temp etc but I only give mine max 2 hours after shaping. I’d say way over proofed but it does spring back as well
https://preview.redd.it/p6l2mffreerd1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=722691c458b582662f69164d4a7ecd0aa2f555e9
Photo of an old bake for reference to my problem.
Overproofed, cut back bulk time
It’s overfermented. There’s basically zero resistance to the finger poke.
Is the recipe for 2 loafs? Also do you use cups or metric?
I don’t think it looks that flat for a dough that is 1/3 whole wheat. Whole grains always yield a flatter loaf. The bran around the whole wheat cuts into the gluten structure.
If you want a taller loaf, you could try reducing the amount of whole wheat flour in favor of white bread flour and seeing if that gives you more of the result you are looking for.
The other thing is that rising times and recipes are just guidelines. The relative humidity in your kitchen or refrigerator, the temperature in your kitchen or refrigerator, and the flour itself (brand, type, region it was grown in, etc.) all contribute to how quickly or slowly dough will proof. In addition to using the poke test, you could juggle your banneton and lightly touch the top of the dough — it should feel marshmallowy when ready.
Try a banneton and better shaping. That was a big factor for my spring.
Your crumb doesn’t look bad in my opinion.
Are you doing a cold proof? The dough is less likely to spread out when you go straight from the fridge to the hot Dutch oven. Switching to a batard shape might help too.
I go from banneton from the fridge -> flip out onto parchment -> slash -> lower into hot Dutch oven, all in under a minute. Here was my last one:
https://preview.redd.it/8pnmxo0wmerd1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8176e982e90e59b5a26ed86f63bebb1c9ed49cfc
The “poke” test is too subjective, but that DOES look like the right amount of “jiggle”.
If you like everything else . . . try less time in the fridge.
Originally, I did the final shape, set 2 hours, into Fridge 4pm, then 7am out to bake. That’s FIFTEEN hours cold proofing.
Made one change. Shifted my entire mixing/Stretch&Fold/FinalShape schedule so Final Shape was at 8pm. Into Fridge 10pm, then 7am out to bake. That’s NINE hours Cold proofing.
And . . . they started looking like “Butterball Turkeys” again.
I’ve read other places that the main thing happening during Cold proofing is that Acid is building up. This is what gives us (most of) the sour flavor, BUT it also CUTS the gluten strands. So, you’ve got to find the right amount of time to get “some” flavor, without destroying “too much” of your gluten development.
Keep everything else the same, and shift your schedule to have less cold proofing.
(Also measure and make sure your fridge is 39f-40f.)
My schedule:
7:30am Mix Levain.
2:00pm Mix Spring Water, Levain, Flour+Salt(premeasured) together
3:00pm First Stretch and Fold (actually I ROLL now, not fold. Then ball it up.)
3:30pm Second Stretch and Roll
4:00pm Third Stretch and Roll
8:00pm Final Shape
10:00pm Into Fridge
7:00am Preheat 450f
7:25am (Temp down to 425f) Bake 25m Top On, Bake 25m Top Off.
8:15am Out to cool on Wire Rack.
Are you doing any stretch and folds during bulk ferment to build structure to your dough?
Try doing bulk ferment for less time, then proofing in the fridge.
I bulk ferment for about 4 hours, then shape, then proof in the fridge for about 2-3 hours. 4 hours proofing at room temp, especially now while still warm out, seems like a really long time to me.
Also watch more YouTube videos on shaping techniques. Shaping makes a HUGE impact on how much upward rise vs outward rise you get,
When I get a flat bake there’s 2 common factors ALWAYS: whole wheat flour and not enough gluten development. It’s never the proofing or bulk fermentation. You are not doing enough folds it’s that simple.
That definitely looks overproofed based on how much you could push the dough in and how much it resisted. If it feels like a barely-inflated balloon then it’s overproofed
Your dough looks perfectly proofed. Honestly, I think you’ve nailed that aspect.
78% hydration is quite high. To be able to achieve a big plump loaf with that high hydration you’d need 1. a high protein, high gluten flour, 2. experience.
Maybe try reducing hydration closer to 70%, so closer to 604g. You could try somewhere in between at first, like 650g.
As others mentioned using a higher portion of extra strong white flour might help. Personally I do not go over 20% wholewheat flour unless I’m in the mood for a healthy, flat loaf. I think I use similar quantities to you and usually aim for 100-150g wholewheat when preparing the autolyse.
I guarantee you the photo on the cover comes from either lower hydration, flour being more tolerant to high hydration, a tighter banneton, a very experienced expert or all the above.
Anyway, it looks lovely and extremely tasty. Shape isn’t everything right!
It does look overproofed, but it could also be something as simple as something like your final stitching before proofing isn’t tight enough.
Also, I am a huge fan of the Flour Water Salt Yeast book. The Poolish breads are out of this world!
Overproofed, can tell from the poke test. You want it to bounce back a bit quicker.
For me, really getting my shaping tighter gave it a ton more spring. When I’m done shaping they feel much more taught, they’re jiggly again the next day but its like everything I tucked inside is ready to explode outwards.
I dont even know if that’s whats actually happening it’s just been working as I got deeper into my process.
4 hours since shaping? Is it in the fridge? Bulk – shape – retard – bake directly from fridge.
What size loaf is that? It appears way too small for that banneton. Round bannetons do not give much support if you do not fill them up.
I think your proofing is fine, you’re not not going to be over to under enough to make that big of a difference tbh, and the comments here _prove_ that, given how no one can even agree if you’re over or under.
Imo the flatness is probably a lack of gluten and/or shaping. As a test you can try doing a proper knead when incorporating your levain to really kick start the gluten development then follow the recipe exactly from there. See how much of a difference that makes and then you’ll know if gluten (or lack thereof) is your issue!